Lou Weinberg — chair of the Westport Community Gardens, and director of the Long Lots Preserve — addresses this open letter to the Planning & Zoning Commission:
You’re being asked to approve an 8-24 that removes the Community Gardens from the Hyde Lane property, after approving an 8-24 that kept them on site.
You’re being asked to approve an 8-24 that destroys and removes the very successful Long Lots Preserve.
You’re being asked to approve an 8–24 that supports, nearly corner to corner, the clear-cutting of all the older tree growth that has existed on this property for generations, removing a valuable buffer for homeowners adjacent to the property.
Dozens of trees including black cherry, black walnut, pine, spruce, maple and others make up this green open space.
Some of the dozens of trees in the Long Lots Preserve.
Please do not approve an 8-24 without a provision to provide equitable space for a new community garden, either on the Hyde Lane site (post construction) or at Burr Farms Fields.
The Hyde Lane site can be done simply, easily and expeditiously with a new site plan that rebuilds the garden in its current location after construction. It could be surrounded by an 8-foot fence and a curb cut with a separate entrance to the Gardens that completely separates that space from the school.
Alternatively, that acre of space can be used for new fields and an equitable garden relocated to Burr Farm Fields.
In addition, please do not approve an 8-24 without provisions for protecting the Long Lots Preserve. If you deem it truly necessary to approve a site plan that replaces the Garden with fields, at least limit the size of the fields to the space that the current garden occupies. Do not allow the building committee to mow down the rest of what limited green open space would be left there.
An alternate site plan includes a community garden, maintains the Long Lots Preserve, and keeps ball fields. The garden has its own curb cut and driveway, separated from the school parking lot by an 8- foot fence.
The Long Lots Preserve is a model of suburban open space environmental rehabilitation that was unanimously approved by the Board of Selectwomen.
100% of the Preserve was community funded. It was developed by local businesses, organizations and residents.
Second Selectwoman Andrea Moore said during the Preserve approval process, “I think this is the type of volunteerism which should be encouraged …. Here to help. Your work is really what this town should be all about.”
Representative Town Meeting moderator Jeff Wieser called the Long Lots Preserve plan “an environmental win for the town.”
Westport’s green space is rapidly dwindling, due to rampant development. This side of town in particular has seen a significant decrease in tree cover. There is extremely little green open space left.
Community Gardens and adjacent Long Lots Preserve (marked by Xs), slated for removal under the current 8-24.
The non-school related part of this 8-24 flies in the face of the sustainability portion of the town’s Plan for Conservation Development, Net Zero 2050 and Westport’s 2021 Tree City USA designation.
The Plan of Conservation Development states, “Open space helps protect natural resources; provide flood storage, wildlife habitat, and tree canopy; enhance overall community appearance; and enhance the quality of life of residents and visitors. Westport residents value the preserved open space areas that add to the overall beauty of the community and want to: maintain the open space areas we have, add more open space areas as opportunities arise… Preserving open space will help make Westport a more sustainable community by retaining natural spaces and sustaining environmental health.”
By destroying the Westport Community Gardens, the Long Lots Preserve and the additional forested acreage, we are doing exactly the opposite of what we teach our children in school.
Chicakdee, in the Long Lots Preserve. (Photo/Lou Weinberg)
Current science standards focus on how the environment works, the systems that sustain healthy environments, and the human impacts on our rapidly degrading ecosystems.
The parcel of land that will be destroyed if you approve this 8-24 supports incredible biodiversity from very healthy populations of organisms native bees, honey bees, butterflies, moths, fireflies, dragonflies to tree frogs, short-tailed weasel, red squirrel, rabbit, harmless garter snakes etc.
This kind of biodiverse green island is nearly gone in Westport. A clean, healthy environment with a hands-on environmental educational benefits is a legacy we can, and should, leave for our children.
This administration and the Long Lots School Building Committee have moved the goal posts consistently for over 2 years. From keeping the gardening community out of the discussion altogether (see former Parks and Recreation cirector Jennifer Fava’s “Oops, I guess they found out”) to “It’s just lines on a map” to “We’re going to keep you on the property” to “You won’t be able to use the gardens for a year” (then “2 years”) to “We’re going to move you to (the unviable) Baron’s South” to “We’re going to put you on the property, but you won’t have access to the Gardens for 3 years” to “We’re going to restrict your hours” to 2 years of our first selectwoman’s State of the Town addresses claiming she would keep the Gardens on the property, to an 8-24 that puts them in some capacity on the property, to another 8-24 removing the gardens from the property altogetherm to the latest proposal to kick this can down the road and figure it out during yet another study (the Parks Master plan).
Long Lots Elementary School site plan. Community Gardens and Long Lots Preserve are circled at left.
I know that the P&Z and the more well-informed residents of our community know that the 120 families that represent the Westport Community Gardens have not delayed progress towards replacing the school by one second.
I hope that those who have paid attention to this effort to build an improved school recognize that the people who support the Garden and Preserve (most of whose children went through our school system and who have paid taxes here for decades) have always promoted building a school, while valuing and protecting what has been created on the 4 acres of open space adjacent to the school.
Destroying the Gardens and using it for staging and then ballfields was not part of the Board of Education specifications in the first place.
The current site plan’s proposed ballfields will cover this lot nearly from corner to corner, and have nothing to do with a new Long Lots Elementary School. This was an add-on by the 1st Selectwoman and building committee.
In addition to the Community Gardens (foreground), trees in the Long Lots Preserve could be removed as part of the school project.
Before Westport Community Gardeners were vilified and demonized as a political tactic to remove the Gardens from the property, schools superintendent Thomas Scarice stated his desire to keep the Gardens/Preserve green open space as a buffer between the school and the adjacent residents.
The destruction of the Westport Community Gardens and Long Lots Preserve, and the refusal to replace them, is not and should not be under the Long Lots School Building Committee’s purview.
Please do not allow the Long Lots School Building Committee to be a de facto land use planning entity. Their charge is to manage getting a school built. Their overreach should be checked by this commission.
Please stand up to the bulldozers and approve an 8-24 where everyone wins; the Long Lots kids, teachers, neighbors, our senior residents, community gardeners, and the environment.
Thank you for your consideration, and for the significant amount of time and effort you put into making decisions that you believe will benefit our town.
(“06880″‘s Opinion pages are open to all. Email submissions to 06880blog@gmail.com.)
A shameful part of Westport’s history.
If you agree with this post, send it into Planning And Zoning as is with your comments. how can the Board of finance say they’ll pay more money for trees when the trees are already there. Bauer place Neighbors fight for your trees!
A school teaches biodiversity but paves over the gardens.
Maybe the children should somehow been involved in the garden. Perhaps they could have their own plot and be taught gardening.
Rise up, Westport. This loss of greenspace, habitat, native preserves is irreversible. The destruction neighbors’ quality of life and property value is irreversible. The hypocrisy of conflicted decision makers is cringeworthy. The tone-deaf declarations of building a Taj Mahal “for the children” is regrettable.
What children need is a quality education, not a guided cage. What the neighbors need is someone, anyone, to respect their right to preserving their home space and property value. What the Westport taxpayer needs are fiduciaries to protect our hard earned money. What Westport needs are people who care about our green space and natural resources such as the river.
This is about the children? Be the example.
Thank you, Lou Weinberg for being that example.
A negative 8-24 would be appropriate for all of the reasons Lou cites. This project should not be approved without provision made for the gardens in an appropriate location.
Well written Lou. Unfortunately the Community Gardeners have been left behind by many Westport stakeholders and decision makers – including by the Board of Education that I sit on.
We are not choosing between a school and a garden – and anyone who tells you that is talking nonsense. Of course Westport needs to prioritize rebuilding Long Lots. We all know it should have been done a decade ago. Coley Elementary is next.
It is 100% possible to prioritize Long Longs rebuild – without leaving the community gardeners in limbo.
Please approve an 8-24 but at the same time provide a clear provision to provide equitable space for a new community garden, either on the Hyde Lane site (post construction) or at Burr Farms Fields.
Thank you, Robert Harrington, for always taking the high road and not bowing to political pressure. You always seem to be the voice of reason, for the gardens, the soccer coach debacle, parking issues, etc. I am sure you ruffle some feathers along the way but it always seems to be while trying your best to be true to the American democratic process. Your transparency and collaborative nature is refreshing but rare these days. Please keep being you!
What a disgrace. So much for those alleged “Westport Values” referred to on a large tablet in Jesup Green that was installed a few years ago: Inclusivity, Equity, Ethical Conduct, Community Engagement, Preservation of Resources, Sustainable Development and so on.
Morley, you need better glasses so you can read the fine print, “except in situations that might have a cost, or be too much work, or make some powerful people upset.”
Ms. Tooker has so many leadership strikes against her she can’t possibly succeed at becoming Governor.
Not sure if this is the last chance but, since it probably is, people and our elected officials need to stand up for the Gardens. Do something, achieve. Please, please.
The families (and the grandparents) of Long Lots School are sooo tired of the back snd forth of the community gardens – we need that school now. People move to westport to give their children s phenomenal education not to start a garden. Thats why our property values are going up. I am an environmentalist in many ways but posponing the building of this school is ridiculous, it should have already begun. Stop the discussion!!!!!!
Your tone and grasp of the garden issue is lacking, you have been tricked, we have never been in competition. so sad our town leaders led your to believe that.
Divide and Conquer has been a governing technique for centuries…..Why? Because it works. But that doesn’t excuse such behavior when we see it un our elected officials. Our jobs as citizens is to try and avoid being “divided” under false pretenses, and when we see it happening, to “discuss” it by pointong out the hypcrosisy.
That so many smart people continue to state that this was always a “School or Garden” desision is a bit sad. Our town was let down by Jen Tooker who forced this as a false choice. Why? I don’t know. I just know that this was entirely avoidable.
I did not move to Westport 25 years ago for the schools. Please don’t assume everyone lives their lives according to your prescription.
Then, look at the demographics of our town. The majority of adults here — the majority of the population — fo not currently have school age children.
Further, the schools get the lions share of my and everyone’s tax dollar already. Now, a good school is no longer sufficient; we have to build a Taj Mahal in the name of people like you. This will be the highest cost school ever built in the area, notwithstanding Don O’Day’s 16%+ manipulation of the comparable.
Your ingratitude speaks volumes.
And don’t dare say this is about the children. If it was, you wouldn’t keep them in that unhealthy building during two years of dangerous construction.
We’re well beyond “it’s for the children.”
Puleeze.
It is clear from Mr. Weinberg letter to the P&Z published on this blog as an opinion piece, that he has a lot of knowledge about the community gardens and the preserve. Unfortunately, he lacks knowledge of the town processes and more importantly the school needs.
What this letter is asking is to either delay the much needed school project, or (conveniently) gift the Burr Farms as a consolation to the community gardens. One cannot demand that the Long Lots School Building Committee follow the process to the letter, and then turn around and ask for a complete disregard to the process when it comes for their own benefit.
Reading this letter, it is no wonder that town officials had such a hard time to work with the WCG steering committee to find a reasonable solution to all of this, and I am not referring to Barrons’ South. If the steering committee was willing, they could have started the dialogue long ago. Instead, they are still making a last plea to stay at Long Lots at a great cost to the rest of the stakeholders.
The P&Z should review the amended 8-24 on its own merit. There are many in this town who are fed up with the politics and this nonsense.
Please collaborate with the town to find a new home for the community gardens. It is time to move on. This has dragged for so long, and has already caused delays.
Joe, wrong again, but you are consistent… too bad you didn’t read the FOIA documents. Our leaders must be snickering at us as their manipulation continues. The elected P and Z has jurisdiction now.
Joe – perhaps talking to them may have been a good place to start.
The P&Z can make this commitment without any need for any delay.
The delays to date have nothing whatsoever to do with the gardens. We are NOT choosing between a school and a garden. As a Board of Ed member I clearly support prioritizing the school building. I am frustrated by these delays. The school should have been knocked down 10 years ago. There have already been two delays to the date of when this school would be ready in this current process. It’s very easy to prioritize the school and still make this commitment.
Exactly! The delays have ZERO to do with the gardens.
Further, taking time to appropriate money appropriately for this EXTRAVAGANT version of a school will not delay the construction of the school, despite what the BOF chair said last night in a tribute to his own predisposition.
Delaying the school grant application should not be used as an excuse to delay the construction schedule.
Spending money on a great education is important and I support it. Building a Rolls Royce of a school has nothing to do with a good education.
Robert,
The P&Z cannot modify the amended 8-24 that is presented to them during the meeting. They can either issue a positive or negative report. Anything other than a positive report would mean delays, similar to the delay we had in Dec 2023.
I didn’t get it when you said that “the P&Z can make this commitment.” What commitment are you referring to?
Do you mean that the garden would be rebuilt at Long Lots as this letter suggests? The land use of the site post-construction as presented in the amended 8-24 will be discussed as part of the meeting on Monday. During the pre-application, I did not hear any objections from the Commissioners on the proposed changes. Sure, a couple of commissioners were not happy that a new location was not found for the gardens, but that be a reason to jeopardize the school project if everything on the new amended 8-24 looks good from a planning perspective.
Or do you mean that the Burr Farms athletic fields would be offered as a condition to the new amended 8-24 application? That would require its own 8-24 application, and it will impact existing land use of Burr Farms. Recall that the new construction is changing the site configuration, and any recreational activities that can no longer fit in the new Long Lots site will need to be discussed separately, and not as part of the Long Lots new school project. There is absolutely no valid reason to delay the amended 8-24 for 13 Hyde Ln for other matters not related to that site.
Joe – if we lived in your world we would never get anything done on any project ever. You have been against the community gardens from the start. This town can do both. You don’t seem to grasp that
Yes they need to get their finger out and another 8-24 at the same time as this latest one.
Nobody trusts this administration and rightly so.
They have done nothing to earn our trust. In fact the polar opposite.
It’s simple.. 2×8-24’s at the same time.. or this one should be thrown out..
not complicated at all.
It is clear from Mr. Nader‘s comments that he has a lot of knowledge about his own opinions. Unfortunately, he lacks the understanding of what Lou knows, what Lou thinks and Lou’s goals and intentions. Unfortunately, his comment above is garbled, misinformed, tactless and factless.
The hundreds of town residents, businesses and organizations that have built the gem that is the gardens/preserve haven’t delayed the school by one second. They don’t have the power to and they don’t want to. Mr. Nader’s comment about town officials having a hard time working with the steering committee smacks of parroting from certain town officials itself. This administration, beyond the empty offer of Baron’s South, has never bothered to work with them. Mr. Nader seems to lean on falsehoods in order to poison the well. He is good at that. A+
And, Mr Nader, nobody is looking to be gifted anything.
Mr. Nader’s unfortunate misunderstanding of the facts and his consistent promotion of a false narrative does not present well.
What I believe Mr. Weinberg is looking for, and has always looked for, is a solution where everyone wins.
So, having never met Mr. Nader and never having had the pleasure of having a conversation with him, I wish him well. There are a lot of well-respected entomologists out there who can help him figure out whatever bug it is that he has. I hope that he can be cured.
Lou knows the town processes better than you do ! As do I actually, as do most commenters.
And what we know is that it has been wholly un transparent, sneaky and not only teetering on dishonest.
The fact that the town attorney works for the driver of this project – Tooker, and therefore will always opine in her favor does NOT mean that their opinion is correct.
It is just that ! An opinion.
Another reason our elected boards who act as check and balance need their own separate council.
Collaboration has failed !
It’s going nowhere. Look at the insulting suggestion of barons poison chalice,
Do not forget the gardens were not on the school “campus”
They were in the vicinity of… that has been well hashed out.
The gardens must be accommodated.
And not any old shady hilly place with zero parking. Not on redundant poisonous soil.
People eat this food.
Accommodating the gardens should have been the primary concern.. not some nuisance to be dealt with later.
We all know how that works !
So support Burrs farms, and this will be put to bed once and for all.
The delay is not and has never been the gardens.
Thank you Ciara, let’s call it what it is, skullduggery!
Very well stated. P&Z wanted (and approved) an 8-24 including the gardens. The Administration never seemed to take that seriously, even though it was their own submission. To okay an 8-24 change without an accommodation for the gardeners would seem to simply reward mendacity. Now the Administration has created a timing crisis in order to discourage scrutiny.
Mendacity….awesome word choice.
It would be an appalling dereliction of duty for PZ to approve the new 8-24 without an assurance from the FSM that the gardens will be going back on that site post build or will be built on site at burrs farms. And that probably has to be formally recognized with a second separate 8-24 AT THE SAME TIME.
At issue is the FACT that the last 8-24 approved by PZ with gardens on the site was a ruse. And it was done to shut people up and move the stalled contentious process along.
BUT they always planned on coming back with another 8-24 excluding the gardens.
This is malicious and ill conceived.
It’s a disgrace !
It is unacceptable.
The shenanigans of this administration know no bounds
Between their support of and push to destroy the gardens, to their sneaky support of the hamlet, to the anti business get rid of parking and screw over the merchants AND RESIDENTS stance. To the ridiculous and unnecessary grossly oversized, grossly over priced shed replacement at Longshore..to the Sherwood island state project, the cribari bridge.
Need I go on ?
WTF is going on in this town.
ITS OUR TOWN, our money, our future, not hers, and we should damn well have a fair say in it.
REMEMBER IN NOVEMBER
Because we deserve better.
Maybe Dan Woog’s contacts in Town Hall can find out if Long Lots and Bauer Place were both farmland in the late 1920s into the mid 1930s. Mr. Bauer might have farmed the property. My grandfather also might have farmed some of it.
We need a school for the students not a resort! What is happening is a detriment to so many others in the town … The government overreach continues.
Lou, you wrote an EXCELLENT piece, well said !
The poorly run Long Lots School Committee, all hand appointed by Tooker, have tried their best to seize this award winning community garden through some type of eminent domain which is ethically and morally wrong. There is no reason for the garden to be relocated. There are numerous sites around town for ballfields. The currently proposed separate curb cut and 8’ fence should keep the most paranoid safety official at ease.
Now that Fotti is gone, I can only hope our new police chief recognizes the gardeners (who were subjected to background checks) have maintained a 25 year history on the site without any incident. Fotti’s demonizing the Gardners as a safety threat in support of his boss, the First Selectwoman, was one on many low points in this painfully slow new school design project.
Going back to the Spring of 2023, this Long Lots Building Committee told parents during the feasibility study discussions, they had no time for a design competition because they had to break ground immediately. Here we are today, two years later and still no groundbreaking. Those of us in the design and construction industry knew all along this was just a ruse. The committee’s tactic of using the “the sky is falling” approach was just their way of minimizing community input. Using their best Trumpian behavior, many school committee members demonized any citizens who were not in lock step behind their vision for the entire site plan.
From the very beginning this school committee has demonstrated a level of arrogance that has proven to be bluster and incompetence, as demonstrated by this week’s approval crisis for State funding. A crisis generated by the school committee’s chairman who lacked the knowledge of critical funding dates, to which his published response was; “my bad”. As if this was not a big deal. Not even a humble, acknowledgment of his culpability with a sincere sounding, heartfelt apology. Amazing, disappointing and yet, not surprising.
To the members of the P&Z, this is your chance to stand up to poor leadership by someone who is clearly unqualified to lead and also happens to think she’d be a great governor (thank you, goodbye and good luck) and support Lou’s vision. Please remember the gardeners have been the abused victims in this fight and have done absolutely nothing wrong to deserve such bullying and disrespect.
~ Joseph V. Vallone, A.I.A.
Thank you, Lou, for the well written letter, and thank you, Dan, for posting it. I’ve been a Garden member for many years and have been shocked by how abusively we’ve been treated by Tooker and her building committee. That’s my overview, but closer to my real feelings I’m out raged that the years of caring for my raised beds PLUS the money I invested in them, (which could actually be thousands if I went back and added it up) have been so rudely ignored. I am among the many seniors to whom the Garden has been a Godsend…a sanctuary, a welcoming community, and place of uplifting beauty. And by the way, the Garden was never a place that excluded anyone, as some people claimed falsely. Joining was easy and membership was reasonable which meant a lot to a senior like me.
So I have a few questions:
-Who in the administration stands to gain financially from the proposed playing field? Is there something we don’t know that has made some individuals so obstinate? There’s a missing piece to this puzzle. Could this be it?
-Why can’t the money that is budgeted for a new playing field be spent on upgrading our existing fields?
Dan, Find out, if you would be so kind, who owned the Long Lots property during the Depression! Thanks
Jack, for a nice donation to 06880, I’m sure someone would be happy to help. I would…..but I have a pretty warped definition of what “nice is.” Otherwise see below for some instructions.
Determining the exact property ownership around Long Lots School in Westport, Connecticut, during the 1930s requires consulting historical land records. The Town Clerk’s Office in Westport maintains these records, which include deeds and property transfers. Accessing these documents can provide detailed information about property ownership during that period.
westportct.gov
Additionally, the Westport Museum for History and Culture offers research collections that may contain maps and documents relevant to your inquiry. Their archives include historical maps of Westport, which could help identify property boundaries and owners in the 1930s.
westporthistory.org
For a comprehensive investigation, you might consider:
Visiting the Westport Town Clerk’s Office: They can assist you in locating and accessing land records from the 1930s.
westportct.gov
Exploring the Westport Museum’s archives: Their collections may include maps and documents detailing property ownership in the Long Lots area during the 1930s.
westporthistory.org
Consulting historical maps: The Connecticut State Library’s digital collections feature maps that could provide visual context to property boundaries and ownership.
westporthistory.org
cslib.contentdm.oclc.org
By examining these resources, you can piece together a clearer picture of property ownership near Long Lots School in the 1930s.
Sources
John McCarthy, I would bet everything I own that you will do it for me to save Dan Woog time!! You can ask Dan too to give you my e-mail to give me the results. About 4 years ago, I corresponded with someone who owned property on Cross Highway not too far from Bayberry Lane. I sent him a picture from the 1940s and he said, “ Yeah, that’s my kitchen area.” My uncle owned the house and supposedly 50 adjacent acres. I remember the property from about 1952. While you’re at it, can you find out how many acres he actually owned? The barn is still there and I remember it well. I think he bought the land for a thousand dollars an acre and farmed it. He owned Backiel’s Roadside Stand until about 1956 where the gas station is on the corner of South Maple Avenue and the Post Road. You’re such a good guy, I know you’ll do it!!
Jack, at least give John the ring first before he does all this work for you.
Be a true Backiel gentleman like we all know you are.
Donna, How about if I take John and you out to dinner at the Spotted Horse when I come up for Dan’s party? As a matter of fact, I’ll treat Dan Woog too! I’m serious because I don’t think my wife is going to Connecticut with me, and I’d love to treat the three of you! I know I could actually go to the Town Hall myself because I plan to be around for a few days. And Donna, you are such a darling! I hope we can make this happen.
A true gentleman you are Jack. They don’t make them like you anymore.
Jack,
Charles R Jaeger sold a plot to “GREENS FARMS ROSE GARDENS INC” on 12/5/27 (48/408), and then it looks like he bought back the property on 1/11/46 (78/680). Not a historian or real estate expert but it looks like the same property (or portion of it) was then sold to the Town of Westport on 3/15/51 (99/234) for $19,000 for the Hyde Road Junior High School. Which became LL Jr HS and then LL El. People who actually know something about this, what did I get wrong?
So LL school property spent time as a Rose Garden……Irony is a beautiful thing.
(Yankees up nicely against the Red Sox, so spent an inning looking this up.)
Yes it was actually a rose farm with greenhouses and a lot of pesticide use, according to historical records that I read. Back in those days there was little regulation on pesticides, if any. The ground soil under the current parking lot is contaminated as a result, and the community garden area was tested and remediated at some point I think. This info is contained in the environmental historical assessment of the parcel.
Toni, My grandfather, father and uncle used DDT pesticide and I actually used to breathe in the poison! Then there was a pink colored “ poison “ and they’d walk backwards spreading! I spent my first 10 years breathing in this stuff. My grandfather’s brother who owned and farmed Hunt Club Lane had 5 kids and all his five children died of cancer. The first died at age 36 when a lump popped out of his neck.
Toni, Dinner on me??? ( Dan Woog, Sorry for all my comments. I’m sure Eric Buchroeder SHS ’70 will lend me 4.)
John, interesting… My father was friends with Andre Jaeger from around 1941, or even earlier. Andre had the greenhouse for decades.Johnathon Jaeger just recently died, at around age 80, worked at the greenhouse. Jalna Jaeger Bird is his daughter who comments on here frequently. Maryann, her sister, from the Staples class of 1964 also recently passed away. I appreciate you looking up that information. When I come back to Westport in July, I am going to visit Town Hall because I’m curious about my uncle’s property on Cross Highway. Again, thanks for your effort!
I just e-mailed this post to Jalna and asked her to read the comments. Maybe she has some insight into all this.
Jalna answered me and said her grandmother sold the Long Lots property to the town and also said the property had a big hill that was leveled to build the school. I remember in or around 1917, the town wanted to give my grandfather the property on South Turkey Hill if he’d agree to pay the tax. He refused the offer because it was too hilly to farm. My guess is if there was a large hill on the Long Lots property, no one would have farmed it. ( The So. Turkey Hill story was orally handed down to me, so I can’t verify it.)